I took these photos at Boondall Wetlands this morning.
I thought it was an Australian Raven but the people at the environment center told me they don't get Ravens there, only Torresian Crows.
I would love your opinion.
Cheers
Devster
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It's very difficult to identify corvids from photos. Best identified by call. I can't see any reason to think your bird is not a Torresian Crow.
Yeah from memory I don't think it had the drawn out Aaark of the Australian Crow, but I find them hard to tell apart at this stage also.
Thanks Steve
The throat hackles on this bird look rather heavy so I'm wondering if this is an Australian Raven, notwithstanding the comment by the people at the environment centre. For the uninitiated, are the Boondall Wetlands within the Australian Raven's range?
yes, Boondall Wetlands are on the northern side of Brisbane, distribution maps suggest higher density of TCrow than ARaven
Peter
Hey Devster. I've studied the local resident Torresian Crows across the road from my place for years, and want to add my own input here about what I think the bird is, going on my own knowledge of Torresian Crows, okay?
Firstly, it is possible your bird is a Torresian Crow. It has (in your first photo) the noticable blue tinge in it's tail feathers. Their blue tinge is very hard to pick up in cameras these days. The head shape (for that head angle) is correct; the wing posture is correct (for recently landing in the tree); the tail length matches the wing length; the entire colouring of the bird looks correct (except for one feature which I'll get to in a second); the eye colouring is about right; and the throat shackles is about right too. There's other features too but they are minor things really.
It took me years to indentify the local crows as actual Torresian Crows. There are some noticable ways to identify Torresian Crows from other corvids, I reckon. Here are mine:
Their feathers, in the sunlight; have an irridescent blue tinge to them but when the bird is in the shade its feathers are all black (no blue tinge). On some angles their feathers can look pure white when direct sunlight is on them. (I said "SOME ANGLES" - not ALL ANGLES.) If this angle is correct then when you photograph them their feathers can appear white in places. They have partial white feathers closest to the skin around their necks and back (probably everywhere actually except on their wings). This is noticable when you spot them preening or bathing and preening. When they come in to land (anywhere) the moment they land they shuffle their wings back onto their back. When they call out they become horizontal (standing) and their wings flick on their back. Its kinda like their entire back end flicks upwards with their wings more noticably moving than their tail at first glance. Torresian Crows mostly eat on the ground and rarely take something to a tree and eat it (its rare but it does happen). They are a communial (can't spell it sorry) bird, meaning they will flock with lots of other crows at a certain time of the year but generally are seen here in pairs or small family groups of 3. Two chicks hatch from the nest but only one survives/fledges and grows into adult hood. The juvenile is with the parents for almost all the time for about 2-3 years straight. Torresian Crows breed every 3 years (once every 3 years) but that varies. In higher rainfall areas they'll breed once a year; during droughts, once every 3 years. They are family orientated and communicate to other Torresian Crow families in the area. All Torresian Crows keep in contact with each other on a multiple daily basis. They are the first bird species to spot a predator and attack it and chase the predator out of the area. Nearby family groups will gang up together to chase the predator/s away. When it comes to predators (birds of prey I'm referring to here) Torresian Crows are vicious, mean and nasty and always win. They commune with Australian Magpies - have a sort of relationship with them. (If you see Australian Magpies you'll see Torresian Crows wherever the Torresian Crows' geographical range is across Australia.) They hunt down and kill snakes. They eat the eyes from feral rabbits. You'll see them on the roadside at road kill sites. The ones here don't eat the road kill just eat the eyes of dead animals. Gross! Oh, and the way they walk is a good clue as well. Under normal circumstances Torresian Crows hop sideways as a normal mode of ground-based locomotion. Torresian Crows, however, can learn to walk like Australian Magpies and humans do but it is a learnt skill. Once learnt, every TC in the area will be doing it before the year is out. But despite that fact, when approaching food on the ground near people they still hop sideways to get food. (To keep one eye on the person I reckon.)
Anyway, going back to your bird, to me it looks like an old Torresian Crow. I say that because a Torresian Crow in it's prime is all black with a blue tinge to it. Older birds tend to start going grey and start losing more feathers than their younger counterparts. The feathers on it's right side looks like typical feather loss (the beginning of it) enmasse as old age sets in or has set in.
Here's a video I took back in 2012 of a Torresian Crow calling to me for food. Please excuse the poor video quality. It was my first camera and my camera made an annoying sound. Notice the eventual horizontal body posture and tail and wing movements when it calls.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h7MGG3P2u3E
Another video and excuse the poor quality and the zooming in, of a Torresian crow preening itself after its rained. It was heavily overcast, so all the white you see are white feathers not sunlight reflecting off the feathers.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gORfaHIYp_A
Adding some photos I took of Torresian Crows as well. I hope it all helps.
I'm at Tenterfield, NSW. (Formerly known as "Hyperbirds".)
great detail there Hyperbirds
as this is based on your local observations can you share your suburb & city
Peter
Oh, sorry about that, pacman. I live in Tenterfield, NSW.
I'm at Tenterfield, NSW. (Formerly known as "Hyperbirds".)
Hyperbirds, that's fascinating information & shows the value of careful observation.
Thanks Woko. Birds are indeed fascinating creatures and are worthy, I reckon, of careful observation. I think it's the only way to truly know how a species is and what it does and how it reacts to things.
I'm at Tenterfield, NSW. (Formerly known as "Hyperbirds".)
Devster, I'm going to add another comment and another observation here that will verify your belief that the photographed bird is not a Torresian Crow as you believe. My first comment concluded it could be a TC but it was inconclusive.
When I first saw your bird photos, especially the first picture, and Torresian Crow was mentioned something did not fit right with me. To be honest when I look at your first photo something tells me it does not look like a Torresian Crow. Something just does not sit right but I can't figure out exactly what. So I'm going to figure it out right here and now. I've spent years watching Torresian Crows from a distance and up close (them comfortably walking around my front lawn 6-8 feet away from me - I used to feed them and the resident Australian Magpie family). So I've got mental images in my head of what Torresian Crows look like up close.
My very first impression of your first photo was there are too many feathers around the head area and they're sticking up. The head looks too small for a Torresian Crow, even for a small bird. And something about the eye doesn't look right for a Torresian Crow. After looking closer at the Torresian Crows photos I took and your photos added above, I have concluded the following:
Your bird is definitely not a Torresian Crow.
I came to this conclusion by comparing the following on your photos and a few more I am adding here, plus a bit more detail about Torresian Crows I forgot to add on my first comment.
Firstly, the eye. The eye on your bird is too high up on it's face. Even though it is roughly the right distance away from the beginning of the beak, your bird's eyes are more on top of it's head than on the side of it's head. If you look closely you'll see that where the upper and lower beak sections join, your bird's eyes are above that half way mark, whereas my birds' eyes are more centrally located. Torresian Crow eyes are located lower down than your bird's eye. Next is the size of your bird's eye. Its too small in size for a Torresian Crow. And because the eye itself is too small, the pupil on your bird is too small compared to my Torresian Crow bird photos. Torresian Crows have big eyes. The pupil is also big in size compared to the coloured part of the eye (iris?).
Secondly, the beak. Compare the beaks of your bird and my birds (the photos I'm adding in this comment) and you will see a vast difference in the shape of them. Your bird has a curved beak and the ends of the beak appear to be the same length whereas Torresian Crows have almost a perfectly straight beak curving downward closer to the end of the beak with the top part of the beak being noticably longer than the bottom half. The top part of the beak has an overhang as I call it. Think of a cockatoo and you get the idea with Torresian Crows. Just visually comparing your bird's beak width to my photos, your bird's beak looks narrower, more dainty , and more curved than a Torresian Crows beak. A Torresian Crow's beak is more like a thick spear used for killing stuff. It also has a noticable flat ridge along the top of it.
Thirdly, the feathers (again). Your bird's feathers doesn't really sit on it's body like a Torresian Crow's feathers do. They are more open to being exposed to the air than anything. Think of it this way, have you ever seen a male Satin Bowerbird's feathers all fluffed up on a regular basis? You probably won't either. Some bird species always have their feathers fluffed up or open to the environment (to keep themselves cool when it's hot?) and others have their feathers flush against their bodies. A Torresian Crow and Satin Bower Bird are two species that have their feathers always flush against their bodies - unless they are preening themselves or bathing. Compare this difference between a seal and dog. A Torresian Crow is like a seal and your bird is more like a dog. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here because its really hard to explain in words. On the other hand a Torresian Crow also looks untidy when it comes to it's feathers. Some bird species have distinctive shapes and that shape is usually uniform and consistent. That's how you can tell a species by it's shape. But with Torresian Crows, more often than not, their shape changes because the birds place their feathers (if you look at the bird side on) in a lightning bolt shape. This occurs in the non-flight position usally when they are resting on a power pole or high in a tree. Parts of their feather sections can actually have straight edges then a sudden change of direction in the feathers that look like a lightning bolt. This lightning bolt effect is not visible all the time but I've had to look twice at some Torresian Crows on power lines to make sure they are Torresian Crows because their shape changes so frequently on cloudy days and all I can make out are their silhouettes.
Fourthly, the legs. I noticed something was amiss about your bird photos vs my photos of Torresian Crows. Your bird has shorter lower legs than Torresian Crows, and the feathers above the leg joint (knee?) look more like the way Australian Magpies' look and sit in that area (like an upside down triangle).
That's it really. I fully believe that your bird is a raven of some sort, and going on the beak alone I'd say it eats a lot of grubs from soft wood trees like cockatoos (eating grubs from trees) do, hence the really curved beak. Your bird looks like it just lives in a forest somewhere. I've never seen a Forest Raven but my first guess would be a Forest Raven. It certainly is NOT a Torresian Crow because it simply isn't stocky enough in shape to be one. When I look at Torresian Crows here in Tenterfield I instantly think of Bulldogs. Big, stocky birds. Not fine, dainty birds like your bird is.
I'm at Tenterfield, NSW. (Formerly known as "Hyperbirds".)
P.S. Torresian Crow's pupils also dilate when in full sun, so their pupil size is like human pupils in that respect.
I'm at Tenterfield, NSW. (Formerly known as "Hyperbirds".)
Very interesting information there Hyper...
My initial impression was Aust Raven based on throat hackles... but yeah as said aust corvids are pretty much impossible to call from photos alone
Yes, apart from the hackles, the thing that struck me is that your bird, Devster, has a much more ruffled appearance than the birds in your photos, Hyperbirds.