Nice shot but I think it would be nice to also have some detail in the post like where it was taken and when and the proper name for it maybe? just a thought anyway as there are many people who never get to see these beautiful creatures and it is good to educate the many browsers that we get that never say much if anything at all.,
Yep. That's Rainbow Bee-eater, Merops ornatus. Cardwell, QLD. These birds fly and catch insects like swallows. But very cautious and spontaneously get away.
Thanks Russianbear - can you also share your settings?/ I am using f8 or either side if the light is OK to try and get better depth of field but none of mine are as sharp and crisp as yours....
I prefer shutter speed priority mode mainly because I'm action photographer. So I use shutter speed value from 1/640 up to 1/4000 depending of sunniness and bird's activity. ISO400 or auto, EV 0.3- 0.7, WB - auto, contrast - soft, saturation - normal, sharpness - soft, noise reduction - off, noise filter - low.
Now , if I can spoil your party about " what settings,depth of field, flash, mode etc, etc,.....), I will show you a photo of mine, I did a whole serious of those, but never told anyone they were all shot on "Auto", I was recommended to take part in an international competition, picked of hundreds of photos. NONE of my photos is done on" manual anything". My opinion is, "these days, cameras, (at least me Sony SLT-A55V, and my Sony lenses), are so good, you can count on them doing a great job on "Auto" Here is one of those photos.
To the photo:
camera : Sony SLT-A55V
Lense: 70-400 F 4.0-5.6
Aperture F5.6
Shutterspeed 1/100 sec
ISO 1600
(sorry for the delay, you might have to wait for the photo to show up, and I hope I'm not offending any of you purists, swearing by only using manual settings. I can hear you criticize my photo, it's not this, that or the other, so be it. The judges in that competition commented on "great field of depth, excellent technique". I did none of that, the camera did it all)
The quality might be not as good as in the original photo, that will be due to the shortcomings of this website.
Sorry Nathan, I love you too!? I was just making a point about taking photos on "Auto", I could have chosen any other sharp photo, but I have just that many wrens. LOL
M-L you can only sometimes get away with auto settings. when there is a bright or dark background or bird the auto exposure on the camera is thrown off so if you want any chance of getting good shots in all conditions the exposure needs to be changed by the photographer. You also have to take into account heaps of other things such as the lighting conditions, the distance from the bird, how much the bird is moving..... I could go on for hours!
Russianbear there is more to your good photos apart from your camera, your skill is tremendous as I am using an Olympus E-5 with the same lens as yours and hardly ever use my ec-14 teleconverter and I don't get near the sharpness and contrast of your photos, I know I should be using a higher shutter speed but most times because of the light I have no choice. One question I would like to ask; do you calibrate the focus on your lenses? Oh and send me your recipe for crisp photos.
Sorry russianbaer for using your thread to answer to Owen.
I have to disagree with what you are saying, unless someone will tell me that my photos are crap, (some are just like everyone elses), so far nothing has thrown my camera off on Auto.
Just one little annecdote, a few weeks ago somebody commented on the outstanding quality of one of my photos, a lot of praise , neatly expressed in all those technical terms. Hmm, when I said to him,nothing in this photo was was done on manual, I got the weirdest and most surprising answer: " well, just imagine what you could do, if you used manual settings"
Suddenly the great photo didn't seem to be that good after all, makes no sense to me. The only explanation to me (the confessed technophobe LOL), is, there is a hole lot of bragging and hot air (bull) about photography.
Russianbear there is more to your good photos apart from your camera, your skill is tremendous as I am using an Olympus E-5 with the same lens as yours and hardly ever use my ec-14 teleconverter and I don't get near the sharpness and contrast of your photos, I know I should be using a higher shutter speed but most times because of the light I have no choice. One question I would like to ask; do you calibrate the focus on your lenses? Oh and send me your recipe for crisp photos.
Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc.
I was just making a point about taking photos on "Auto", I could have chosen any other sharp photo, but I have just that many wrens. LOL
M-L, your lens is great and provide good quality of pics. But your setting is OK for birds which are sitting without movement. If birds start to move the shutterspeed 1/100 will not short enough to freeze them.
there is a hole lot of bragging and hot air (bull) about photography.
M-L ... calm down my dear..... there will always be those in every field who use more expensive equipment and intricate use of technology in whatever field you choose to participate in. There seems to me that there must be more to your objection than someone using their camera on manual settings ..... certainly because someone states that they prefer to override the settings manually does not mean that it follows that your photos are crap!!!
The professional range of lenses in any brand and I know particularly in Canon's case, are physically very different in their materials and construction for one thing, and when you get down to the very details of resolution and reproduction they will always produce superior results if used correctly. That is just a fact.... and as far as the hot air and bragging well that is just an individual thing and is not reserved for those with an interest in photography I can assure you.
I know you prefer a story and converstion to just grandstanding with great photos but I guess it takes all sorts of members to make up a forum and we are never all going to be the same!
I am sure the art world in general is full of BS and there are purists in every field ..... your photos are great and no one is saying otherwise here .
I am calm birdie. As for superiority, in particular of the new generation of cameras and lenses, can I just mention two words, Sony and Carl Zeiss, no more needs to be said.
I should never have mentioned, that all my photos are taken on Auto, nobody would have thought so. Too late now, the results obviously don't speek for me,( i'm an amateur that only has had a camera for a very short time) but speak for the quality of the Sony equipment I'm using. Thanks to my husband, who BTW uses a Pentax,(but wants to switch to a Sony now), but read all the research about cameras available, before he decided to give me the Sony last year as a present.
Thanks russianbear, most of the birds do not sit still, that's why I do all bird photography on Sports Mode, taking several pictures in succession. The Sony SLT 55V and the new 77V are a compleately different new generation of camera, with the translucent mirror. As I said before, why don't you do read up on it. I don't feel like talking about it anymore,as you don't seem to take anything I say seriously, mainly because I admitted not to be an expert like all of you seem to be, I will give this a long break, thanks.
Oh, just one more remark, the birds in my garden do move around, sharp photos I take from time to time are a credit to my ability to "read the birds, and to get close to them". In my eyes this is a very important part of being a good photographer. (a bit arrogant? You can be the judge)
Of course all your photos are great M-L and I am always amazed by them and you do put hard work and time into your photos, I can't take credit away from you and your photos are NOT crap!
I was just trying to say if you have a play around with your settings you might be even happier with your shots.
You wrote ' Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc. ''''' "
Do you think that this perhaps the key to your crisp sharp photographs??
My other thought is that perhaps the other key to 'best photos' is the distance from birds to camera. My shots of birds that are close - say around 3-5 metres are adequate - its those more than 10m away that are not crisp?? - Like your bee eater that promted my question. Can you recall how far away the bee eater was??
One other thought - do you use a UV filter on your lenses? - It's another piece of glass for the light to go through??
Thanks russianbear, most of the birds do not sit still, that's why I do all bird photography on Sports Mode, taking several pictures in succession. The Sony SLT 55V and the new 77V are a compleately different new generation of camera, with the translucent mirror. As I said before, why don't you do read up on it. I don't feel like talking about it anymore,as you don't seem to take anything I say seriously, mainly because I admitted not to be an expert like all of you seem to be, I will give this a long break, thanks.
M-L, Sport mode is very rough indeed. My camera already hasn't this feature. Actually shutter speed range varies from bulb up to 1/8000 and more. Each situation requires a special value of it, that's optimal or more suitable for aim of photographer. Resolution of lens of any brand is just matter of price.
You wrote ' Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc. ''''' "
Do you think that this perhaps the key to your crisp sharp photographs??
My other thought is that perhaps the other key to 'best photos' is the distance from birds to camera. My shots of birds that are close - say around 3-5 metres are adequate - its those more than 10m away that are not crisp?? - Like your bee eater that promted my question. Can you recall how far away the bee eater was??
One other thought - do you use a UV filter on your lenses? - It's another piece of glass for the light to go through??
Thanks in advance for your reply.
Hi ZambeziBoy, if you would have a look at most, (all) of my best photos, they are taken from very CLOSE, with a fully extended 400mm lens, hand held, producing the best result.
As I said above, ":learn to read the bird, and get as close as you can". Sorry, I'm repeating myself, not everything is about technology. There is something else here, nobody has talked about, that is something I can claim without arrogance for myself, that is the " Artist Eye"
Oh, just one more remark, the birds in my garden do move around, sharp photos I take from time to time are a credit to my ability to "read the birds, and to get close to them". In my eyes this is a very important part of being a good photographer. (a bit arrogant? You can be the judge)
You wrote ' Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc. ''''' "
Do you think that this perhaps the key to your crisp sharp photographs??
My other thought is that perhaps the other key to 'best photos' is the distance from birds to camera. My shots of birds that are close - say around 3-5 metres are adequate - its those more than 10m away that are not crisp?? - Like your bee eater that promted my question. Can you recall how far away the bee eater was??
One other thought - do you use a UV filter on your lenses? - It's another piece of glass for the light to go through??
Thanks in advance for your reply.
I don't know exactly. In my case the key was experience and reading photosight's topics. I've felt big improving in my performance when I learned to keep the camera stable and push button gently. I use UV filter but just for protection of lens. Distance certainly has significant influence but my lenses allow me do not approach birds closely. I don't use special hiding technique. In that particular case the distance was about 6 m.
Thanks russianbear, I just found out that I had my noise filter set to low when I thought I had turned it off and I will have a look for that Noiseware program. I do use photoshop for levels adjustment, to crop and use the unsharp mask with settings of Amount-100%, Radius-0.3 and threshold-0, ocassionally I will use some Vibrancy adjustment. Now all I need is more skill.
ZambeziBoy I would like to reply to you about the use of filters. I guess it stands to reason that the less you place in front of the lens the better it will be. This debate has been back and forth on the forums for some time and there isn't a diffinitive answer as yet. But, I will say that I have had my 50mm-200mm lens for about six months and had a uv filter on since day 1 and I have quite a few scratches on that filter at the moment, so now I am up for another $75 filter instead of a $1200 lens and I don't get nervous when I clean the filter instead of the front element of the lens. By the way you don't need a UV filter like the film cameras as the sensors take care of that now. I haven't noticed a loss of sharpness or colour due to my UV filter, my unstaedy hands would ruin a photo before my filter would.
Thanks RussianBear and Shane for sharing your comments and advice.
Just a quick story about ditance from camera! Some 30 years ago in PNG (before digital) a guy showed me some wonderfully sharp photos - I think they were for a book he was doing...anyway I asked him his technique and he invited me out early the next Sunday. Before dawn we placed two mist nets high in the trees (are they legal in Oz? He had a special permit), then boiled the billy and soon went to untangle the caught birds.We kept the one he wanted in a soft bag, then placed him gently in a soft white cotton framed box with good light. Waited until the bird had pruned himself and then many good crisp clear photos were taken from no more than 2 feet away through a slit in the sheet before the bird was releasd unharmed....must dig those slides out one day and have another look!
ZambeziBoy I would like to reply to you about the use of filters. I guess it stands to reason that the less you place in front of the lens the better it will be. This debate has been back and forth on the forums for some time and there isn't a diffinitive answer as yet. But, I will say that I have had my 50mm-200mm lens for about six months and had a uv filter on since day 1 and I have quite a few scratches on that filter at the moment, so now I am up for another $75 filter instead of a $1200 lens and I don't get nervous when I clean the filter instead of the front element of the lens. By the way you don't need a UV filter like the film cameras as the sensors take care of that now. I haven't noticed a loss of sharpness or colour due to my UV filter, my unstaedy hands would ruin a photo before my filter would.
clif2 ... totally agree with you about the use of the filters. Better to damage that than the front element for sure. Even on my cheap 75-300 lens I still use one. Like you ... my unsteadiness ruins my shots more than the filter would. I think you would have to be working at a very high end of technical spec requirements before you could say it would ruin your pics ... and really...are any of us needing that ??? I guess it depends what you intend to use your pics for and where you will be viewing them anyway.
Hi Araminta (and others, but just a note to Araminta mainly) - as you may be aware, Bob takes all our photos unless he's away and I see something great. Bob uses auto, (a Canon EOS400D with a 300mm lens or a Sigma 500mm lens) and often uses the sports mode, as his eyes are getting old like the rest of us, and seeing the settings on the camera sometimes takes too long. We get some marvellous shots (in our opinion anyway) as well as some not-so-good ones, and as we mainly use them to help us definitely identify the birds when we get home we have been very happy with these. We don't have your patience Araminta so don't always get your magnificent close-ups, but we are happy to admire your photos, and get on with doing our own thing. Please keep on producing your great photos, and everyone else, please also do the same. We love looking at the photos you all produce on this forum.
Oh, thank you so much for your very kind and encouraging words. Good to know there are others who take great photos on autofocus, like Bob and you, and most likely others on this forum. Although somewhat disappointed by the way this discussion went, I'm not going anywhere, I will go on annoying everyone with my " wren photos ", and all the other little birds in my garden.
I just hope this is not keeping others from posting photos, even if they might now think the photos weren't sharp or good enough. It would be very sad, if that happens. I enjoy everyone's photos, this forum should not be about the perfect photo, it should be about our admiration and love for birds. Thanks Meave.
I often use sportsmode too. Not all the time - depends on where I am, what mood I'm in and what the weather is like! If I've been taking other shots of things and a bird suddenly catches my eye then that mode is the quickest to set and start snapping :-) It works well for me. I do sports action photography at times and it's the mode I use most of the time for that anyway, so it works well for birds moving around.
Modern cameras have a lot of special features as well as technique of photography. Using auto and sports modes you just limit your capabilities. Can you make a simillar picture using just sports mode?
Well, I've not tried one like you have above but I do have bees in flight and birds in flight having used sports action - as I said, I don't use it all the time but have often used it when it suits.
The whole point is that we are all at different stages of our photography and with different equipment. For some people it is enough to concentrate on the artisitic side of just composing a nice pic and let the camera do its best for you. For others there is nore need to control and freeze the movement and also set varying things to allow for different cirumstances. This should not be an argument between those who can and those who either cannot or dont want to.
These discussions have always occurred on here and essentially this is an amateur forum where people come together to discover birds and learn about their habits and IDs and locations from others who may have more experience than them. Sometimes we have photographers who just want to show their photos , but this does not exclude the rest who just want to share their experience and joy at a sighting. We love to see all levels of photography that enable us to share the joy that birding gives all our members.
There are other forums where there is plenty of critique and technical talk and I have to say that I hope this will never be one. When I want to see sstunning photographjy with lots of post production sharpening etc that is where I head. However stunning the shots are I try not to read the blurbing critique that comes after as I find it largtely just a distraction from the beauty of the moment .
If a few members want to get technical and discuss their shots then those who don't want to read it are not really forced to.
The main thing is that we are a friendly forum where we enjoy a love of birds both in and out of our own back yards and we all love to share our photos .... we should not be comaparing them to others in my opinion as it is just irrelevant unless you wish to gain experience from that person or more info on the kind of gear used.
This will be long, so get a drink or go to the toilet first. LOL
A few thoughts that I can think of now....
First thing Birdie, et all.
FORGET filters on any lens, especially the consumer grade ones. Use a lens hood instead. Most of the cheaper lenses are of not so good quality glass and I promise you I also started with a Canon 75-300mm zoom. Hardly a good lens for most wildlife applications. However, it was still capable of taking reasonable photos. Every additional glass element will FURTHER degrade your lens' performance. If you have a 200-dollar lens, would you spend another 200-300 bucks to buy the best glass filter you can? I hardly think so. What should you expect from a 30-dollar filter? Not much. Yes, it WILL make a difference.
I will attach an example of a kit-lens shot to this, so judge for yourself. It is very frustrating, but the key is to shoot lots, in GOOD quality light, get a fast shutter speed and stop aperture down a fraction at least (say one stop). Also, GET CLOSE to the birds. Photographing them from 50m away and then cropping the image to hell will not do any favours if you want good results. Of course, if you just want a record snap, then it's fine.
As Adrienne (Birdie) said Canon have the L range, which is just incredible for image quality. Do you think I whack a piece of glass on the front of my $8,000 lens? Kidding right? I use the hood, take care and if I damage the front element it will be relatively cheap to repair. The important lens elements are out of harm's way, within the lens barell, sealed from dust and rain. :-) I want nothing to interfere with my lens' ability to get the best resolution and detail.
Marie-Louise and others
The most important thing with digital photography to know is the histogram. It tells you what tones you've captured and how much. Most of the detail is captured in the lighter tones, towards the right, hence why you may have heard the old adage "Shoot to the right" (STR). This means shooting RAW files and exposing so that the image has more lighter toned pixels than dark, because darks will show more noise, especially if underexposed. The STR principle guides you to always shoot RAW and slightly overexpose (use the histogram to check) so that you DO NOT clip the highlights on the right side. OK, a small amount, very, very small, amount of clipping is manageable, but more than that is not good as you lose highlight detail. The exception is when you shoot a dark bird against a WHITE or very light background, eg sky. The cameras' sensors just don't have the dynamic range to record a large number of tonalities, hence if you expose for the bird then you will blow the sky and highlights. Nothing you can do there. I can show some examples if you're interested, but here's one...
I overexposed the Wedge-tailed Eagle by close to three stops! And it's a full frame shot. She came rather close....
By shooting to the right, you are minimizing noise in the shadowed areas. See this shot at ISO1000 with NO noise reduction applied at all. Shot with a 500mm f/4L IS USM lens and stacked 1.4x and 2x converters making a 1,400mm lens, which would magnify ANY bit of noise so severely I'd cry. So it's all about the digital shooting technique, using the histogram etc.. This image is close to full frame!
With birds, shutter speed is often king. More so than not. I always pick the most open (widest) aperture and highest ISO that I can use, generally up to ISO800 and shoot in aperture priority mode. I want to control depth of field more than anything else. Shutter speeds are relevant, but with static subjects, slow speeds are also good. Using a good tripod also helps as does good technique of holding the gear. The more focal lenght the more magnification, the more vibrations show really easily on the sensor.
Here is the shot with the kit zoom lens. Almost full frame too!
I have to go now, but am happy to come back for more discussion. Feel free to ask anything. There are many ways to skin a cat (not literally) and everyone has their own ways. I strive to create great images and am quite obsessed with wildlife photography so I bought the best equipment I could afford and learned how to use it. With digital, there is a lot of technology to understand, a lot of areas that you need to be aware of, and most important (again) the histogram. It's your best friend. I have an example in a tutorial on how to minimize noise during capture, it should be sufficient to explain what shoot to the right is and how to correct overexposed images in post process.
This will be long, so get a drink or go to the toilet first. LOL
A few thoughts that I can think of now....
First thing Birdie, et all.
FORGET filters on any lens, especially the consumer grade ones. Use a lens hood instead. Most of the cheaper lenses are of not so good quality glass and I promise you I also started with a Canon 75-300mm zoom. Hardly a good lens for most wildlife applications. However, it was still capable of taking reasonable photos. Every additional glass element will FURTHER degrade your lens' performance. If you have a 200-dollar lens, would you spend another 200-300 bucks to buy the best glass filter you can? I hardly think so. What should you expect from a 30-dollar filter? Not much. Yes, it WILL make a difference.
Well firstly, thanks for the pertinent warning to start Akos...that was a mammoth effort...and secondly thanks for blowing me out of the water with my ideas on filters LOL . I will bow to your superior knowledge and experience here, only because I know you and absoolutely adore your photography! Maybe I will take the filter off the end of my lens but then I would have to take more care with that piece of garbage ( the lens) than what I usually do ! I can think of a lot of other reasons why my work is so bad lately..... mainly it is camera movement and poor judgement on my part. When I get a steadier hand I will take iti off and see if anything improves.
Thank you so much for taking the time and as usual being generous with your offer of help to any of us that may be in need. Feel free to share your obsessiveness abotu wildlife photography with me any time you want to :) I can never get over the results shown in your Cisticola shots with the stacked gear ..they are fantastic!
I so wanna see one of these lovely birds!
Great pic thanks.
Nice shot but I think it would be nice to also have some detail in the post like where it was taken and when and the proper name for it maybe? just a thought anyway as there are many people who never get to see these beautiful creatures and it is good to educate the many browsers that we get that never say much if anything at all.,
Sunshine Coast Queensland
Great pic. I too would love to see one of these in real life.
Karen
Brisbane southside.
Yep. That's Rainbow Bee-eater, Merops ornatus. Cardwell, QLD. These birds fly and catch insects like swallows. But very cautious and spontaneously get away.
Regards
Alex
Russian Bear I am in awe at the sharpness of your photos!! Please share your camera, lens and other details with us....
ZambeziBoy
That's Olympus E-3 with ZD 50-200SWD lens and EC-20 teleconvertor.
Regards
Alex
Thanks Russianbear - can you also share your settings?/ I am using f8 or either side if the light is OK to try and get better depth of field but none of mine are as sharp and crisp as yours....
many thanks in advance
Good birding!
Steve
I prefer shutter speed priority mode mainly because I'm action photographer. So I use shutter speed value from 1/640 up to 1/4000 depending of sunniness and bird's activity. ISO400 or auto, EV 0.3- 0.7, WB - auto, contrast - soft, saturation - normal, sharpness - soft, noise reduction - off, noise filter - low.
Regards
Alex
Now , if I can spoil your party about " what settings,depth of field, flash, mode etc, etc,.....), I will show you a photo of mine, I did a whole serious of those, but never told anyone they were all shot on "Auto", I was recommended to take part in an international competition, picked of hundreds of photos. NONE of my photos is done on" manual anything". My opinion is, "these days, cameras, (at least me Sony SLT-A55V, and my Sony lenses), are so good, you can count on them doing a great job on "Auto" Here is one of those photos.
To the photo:
camera : Sony SLT-A55V
Lense: 70-400 F 4.0-5.6
Aperture F5.6
Shutterspeed 1/100 sec
ISO 1600
(sorry for the delay, you might have to wait for the photo to show up, and I hope I'm not offending any of you purists, swearing by only using manual settings. I can hear you criticize my photo, it's not this, that or the other, so be it. The judges in that competition commented on "great field of depth, excellent technique". I did none of that, the camera did it all)
The quality might be not as good as in the original photo, that will be due to the shortcomings of this website.
M-L
Gosh araminta,do you have to go flooding every single topic with your baby wrens?!?!
Haha,jk,jk,i promise i love them,even if i dont sound like it
Sorry Nathan, I love you too!? I was just making a point about taking photos on "Auto", I could have chosen any other sharp photo, but I have just that many wrens. LOL
M-L
That's a good Bee-eater Russianbear.
M-L you can only sometimes get away with auto settings. when there is a bright or dark background or bird the auto exposure on the camera is thrown off so if you want any chance of getting good shots in all conditions the exposure needs to be changed by the photographer. You also have to take into account heaps of other things such as the lighting conditions, the distance from the bird, how much the bird is moving..... I could go on for hours!
Cheers, Owen.
Russianbear there is more to your good photos apart from your camera, your skill is tremendous as I am using an Olympus E-5 with the same lens as yours and hardly ever use my ec-14 teleconverter and I don't get near the sharpness and contrast of your photos, I know I should be using a higher shutter speed but most times because of the light I have no choice. One question I would like to ask; do you calibrate the focus on your lenses? Oh and send me your recipe for crisp photos.
Regards
Shane
Sorry russianbaer for using your thread to answer to Owen.
I have to disagree with what you are saying, unless someone will tell me that my photos are crap, (some are just like everyone elses), so far nothing has thrown my camera off on Auto.
Just one little annecdote, a few weeks ago somebody commented on the outstanding quality of one of my photos, a lot of praise , neatly expressed in all those technical terms. Hmm, when I said to him,nothing in this photo was was done on manual, I got the weirdest and most surprising answer: " well, just imagine what you could do, if you used manual settings"
Suddenly the great photo didn't seem to be that good after all, makes no sense to me. The only explanation to me (the confessed technophobe LOL), is, there is a hole lot of bragging and hot air (bull) about photography.
M-L
Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc.
Regards
Alex
M-L, your lens is great and provide good quality of pics. But your setting is OK for birds which are sitting without movement. If birds start to move the shutterspeed 1/100 will not short enough to freeze them.
Regards
Alex
M-L ... calm down my dear..... there will always be those in every field who use more expensive equipment and intricate use of technology in whatever field you choose to participate in. There seems to me that there must be more to your objection than someone using their camera on manual settings ..... certainly because someone states that they prefer to override the settings manually does not mean that it follows that your photos are crap!!!
The professional range of lenses in any brand and I know particularly in Canon's case, are physically very different in their materials and construction for one thing, and when you get down to the very details of resolution and reproduction they will always produce superior results if used correctly. That is just a fact.... and as far as the hot air and bragging well that is just an individual thing and is not reserved for those with an interest in photography I can assure you.
I know you prefer a story and converstion to just grandstanding with great photos but I guess it takes all sorts of members to make up a forum and we are never all going to be the same!
I am sure the art world in general is full of BS and there are purists in every field ..... your photos are great and no one is saying otherwise here .
Sunshine Coast Queensland
I am calm birdie. As for superiority, in particular of the new generation of cameras and lenses, can I just mention two words, Sony and Carl Zeiss, no more needs to be said.
I should never have mentioned, that all my photos are taken on Auto, nobody would have thought so. Too late now, the results obviously don't speek for me,( i'm an amateur that only has had a camera for a very short time) but speak for the quality of the Sony equipment I'm using. Thanks to my husband, who BTW uses a Pentax,(but wants to switch to a Sony now), but read all the research about cameras available, before he decided to give me the Sony last year as a present.
Thanks russianbear, most of the birds do not sit still, that's why I do all bird photography on Sports Mode, taking several pictures in succession. The Sony SLT 55V and the new 77V are a compleately different new generation of camera, with the translucent mirror. As I said before, why don't you do read up on it. I don't feel like talking about it anymore,as you don't seem to take anything I say seriously, mainly because I admitted not to be an expert like all of you seem to be, I will give this a long break, thanks.
M-L
Oh, just one more remark, the birds in my garden do move around, sharp photos I take from time to time are a credit to my ability to "read the birds, and to get close to them". In my eyes this is a very important part of being a good photographer. (a bit arrogant? You can be the judge)
M-L
Love the Bee-eater. We don't get those down here - not that I know of anyway.
Kathiemt
Selby, Victoria
Of course all your photos are great M-L and I am always amazed by them and you do put hard work and time into your photos, I can't take credit away from you and your photos are NOT crap!
I was just trying to say if you have a play around with your settings you might be even happier with your shots.
Cheers, Owen.
Thanks RussianBear!
You wrote ' Shane, pay attention on the noise setting. Noise filters reduce detalisation. I use special software for noise reduction - Noiseware Communiti Edition. Trial version is quite suitable. Then I make some sharping after resizing and use photoshop for correction colors, contrast,etc. ''''' "
Do you think that this perhaps the key to your crisp sharp photographs??
My other thought is that perhaps the other key to 'best photos' is the distance from birds to camera. My shots of birds that are close - say around 3-5 metres are adequate - its those more than 10m away that are not crisp?? - Like your bee eater that promted my question. Can you recall how far away the bee eater was??
One other thought - do you use a UV filter on your lenses? - It's another piece of glass for the light to go through??
Thanks in advance for your reply.
M-L, Sport mode is very rough indeed. My camera already hasn't this feature. Actually shutter speed range varies from bulb up to 1/8000 and more. Each situation requires a special value of it, that's optimal or more suitable for aim of photographer. Resolution of lens of any brand is just matter of price.
Regards
Alex
Hi ZambeziBoy, if you would have a look at most, (all) of my best photos, they are taken from very CLOSE, with a fully extended 400mm lens, hand held, producing the best result.
As I said above, ":learn to read the bird, and get as close as you can". Sorry, I'm repeating myself, not everything is about technology. There is something else here, nobody has talked about, that is something I can claim without arrogance for myself, that is the " Artist Eye"
M-L
here is what I said before, ZambeziBoy.
M-L
I don't know exactly. In my case the key was experience and reading photosight's topics. I've felt big improving in my performance when I learned to keep the camera stable and push button gently. I use UV filter but just for protection of lens. Distance certainly has significant influence but my lenses allow me do not approach birds closely. I don't use special hiding technique. In that particular case the distance was about 6 m.
Regards
Alex
Thanks russianbear, I just found out that I had my noise filter set to low when I thought I had turned it off and I will have a look for that Noiseware program. I do use photoshop for levels adjustment, to crop and use the unsharp mask with settings of Amount-100%, Radius-0.3 and threshold-0, ocassionally I will use some Vibrancy adjustment. Now all I need is more skill.
Regards
Shane
ZambeziBoy I would like to reply to you about the use of filters. I guess it stands to reason that the less you place in front of the lens the better it will be. This debate has been back and forth on the forums for some time and there isn't a diffinitive answer as yet. But, I will say that I have had my 50mm-200mm lens for about six months and had a uv filter on since day 1 and I have quite a few scratches on that filter at the moment, so now I am up for another $75 filter instead of a $1200 lens and I don't get nervous when I clean the filter instead of the front element of the lens. By the way you don't need a UV filter like the film cameras as the sensors take care of that now. I haven't noticed a loss of sharpness or colour due to my UV filter, my unstaedy hands would ruin a photo before my filter would.
Regards
Shane
Thanks RussianBear and Shane for sharing your comments and advice.
Just a quick story about ditance from camera! Some 30 years ago in PNG (before digital) a guy showed me some wonderfully sharp photos - I think they were for a book he was doing...anyway I asked him his technique and he invited me out early the next Sunday. Before dawn we placed two mist nets high in the trees (are they legal in Oz? He had a special permit), then boiled the billy and soon went to untangle the caught birds.We kept the one he wanted in a soft bag, then placed him gently in a soft white cotton framed box with good light. Waited until the bird had pruned himself and then many good crisp clear photos were taken from no more than 2 feet away through a slit in the sheet before the bird was releasd unharmed....must dig those slides out one day and have another look!
Happy birding
Steve
clif2 ... totally agree with you about the use of the filters. Better to damage that than the front element for sure. Even on my cheap 75-300 lens I still use one. Like you ... my unsteadiness ruins my shots more than the filter would. I think you would have to be working at a very high end of technical spec requirements before you could say it would ruin your pics ... and really...are any of us needing that ??? I guess it depends what you intend to use your pics for and where you will be viewing them anyway.
Sunshine Coast Queensland
Hi Araminta (and others, but just a note to Araminta mainly) - as you may be aware, Bob takes all our photos unless he's away and I see something great. Bob uses auto, (a Canon EOS400D with a 300mm lens or a Sigma 500mm lens) and often uses the sports mode, as his eyes are getting old like the rest of us, and seeing the settings on the camera sometimes takes too long. We get some marvellous shots (in our opinion anyway) as well as some not-so-good ones, and as we mainly use them to help us definitely identify the birds when we get home we have been very happy with these. We don't have your patience Araminta so don't always get your magnificent close-ups, but we are happy to admire your photos, and get on with doing our own thing. Please keep on producing your great photos, and everyone else, please also do the same. We love looking at the photos you all produce on this forum.
Meave
Oh, thank you so much for your very kind and encouraging words. Good to know there are others who take great photos on autofocus, like Bob and you, and most likely others on this forum. Although somewhat disappointed by the way this discussion went, I'm not going anywhere, I will go on annoying everyone with my " wren photos ", and all the other little birds in my garden.
I just hope this is not keeping others from posting photos, even if they might now think the photos weren't sharp or good enough. It would be very sad, if that happens. I enjoy everyone's photos, this forum should not be about the perfect photo, it should be about our admiration and love for birds. Thanks Meave.
M-L
I often use sportsmode too. Not all the time - depends on where I am, what mood I'm in and what the weather is like! If I've been taking other shots of things and a bird suddenly catches my eye then that mode is the quickest to set and start snapping :-) It works well for me. I do sports action photography at times and it's the mode I use most of the time for that anyway, so it works well for birds moving around.
Kathiemt
Selby, Victoria
Modern cameras have a lot of special features as well as technique of photography. Using auto and sports modes you just limit your capabilities. Can you make a simillar picture using just sports mode?
Regards
Alex
Well, I've not tried one like you have above but I do have bees in flight and birds in flight having used sports action - as I said, I don't use it all the time but have often used it when it suits.
Kathiemt
Selby, Victoria
The whole point is that we are all at different stages of our photography and with different equipment. For some people it is enough to concentrate on the artisitic side of just composing a nice pic and let the camera do its best for you. For others there is nore need to control and freeze the movement and also set varying things to allow for different cirumstances. This should not be an argument between those who can and those who either cannot or dont want to.
These discussions have always occurred on here and essentially this is an amateur forum where people come together to discover birds and learn about their habits and IDs and locations from others who may have more experience than them. Sometimes we have photographers who just want to show their photos , but this does not exclude the rest who just want to share their experience and joy at a sighting. We love to see all levels of photography that enable us to share the joy that birding gives all our members.
There are other forums where there is plenty of critique and technical talk and I have to say that I hope this will never be one. When I want to see sstunning photographjy with lots of post production sharpening etc that is where I head. However stunning the shots are I try not to read the blurbing critique that comes after as I find it largtely just a distraction from the beauty of the moment .
If a few members want to get technical and discuss their shots then those who don't want to read it are not really forced to.
The main thing is that we are a friendly forum where we enjoy a love of birds both in and out of our own back yards and we all love to share our photos .... we should not be comaparing them to others in my opinion as it is just irrelevant unless you wish to gain experience from that person or more info on the kind of gear used.
Sunshine Coast Queensland
This will be long, so get a drink or go to the toilet first. LOL
A few thoughts that I can think of now....
First thing Birdie, et all.
FORGET filters on any lens, especially the consumer grade ones. Use a lens hood instead. Most of the cheaper lenses are of not so good quality glass and I promise you I also started with a Canon 75-300mm zoom. Hardly a good lens for most wildlife applications. However, it was still capable of taking reasonable photos. Every additional glass element will FURTHER degrade your lens' performance. If you have a 200-dollar lens, would you spend another 200-300 bucks to buy the best glass filter you can? I hardly think so. What should you expect from a 30-dollar filter? Not much. Yes, it WILL make a difference.
I will attach an example of a kit-lens shot to this, so judge for yourself. It is very frustrating, but the key is to shoot lots, in GOOD quality light, get a fast shutter speed and stop aperture down a fraction at least (say one stop). Also, GET CLOSE to the birds. Photographing them from 50m away and then cropping the image to hell will not do any favours if you want good results. Of course, if you just want a record snap, then it's fine.
As Adrienne (Birdie) said Canon have the L range, which is just incredible for image quality. Do you think I whack a piece of glass on the front of my $8,000 lens? Kidding right? I use the hood, take care and if I damage the front element it will be relatively cheap to repair. The important lens elements are out of harm's way, within the lens barell, sealed from dust and rain. :-) I want nothing to interfere with my lens' ability to get the best resolution and detail.
Marie-Louise and others
The most important thing with digital photography to know is the histogram. It tells you what tones you've captured and how much. Most of the detail is captured in the lighter tones, towards the right, hence why you may have heard the old adage "Shoot to the right" (STR). This means shooting RAW files and exposing so that the image has more lighter toned pixels than dark, because darks will show more noise, especially if underexposed. The STR principle guides you to always shoot RAW and slightly overexpose (use the histogram to check) so that you DO NOT clip the highlights on the right side. OK, a small amount, very, very small, amount of clipping is manageable, but more than that is not good as you lose highlight detail. The exception is when you shoot a dark bird against a WHITE or very light background, eg sky. The cameras' sensors just don't have the dynamic range to record a large number of tonalities, hence if you expose for the bird then you will blow the sky and highlights. Nothing you can do there. I can show some examples if you're interested, but here's one...
I overexposed the Wedge-tailed Eagle by close to three stops! And it's a full frame shot. She came rather close....
http://amatteroflight.com/gallery2/v/ausbirds/hawks/wdgteag/Wedge-tailed-Eagle_AGL5408.jpg.html
By shooting to the right, you are minimizing noise in the shadowed areas. See this shot at ISO1000 with NO noise reduction applied at all. Shot with a 500mm f/4L IS USM lens and stacked 1.4x and 2x converters making a 1,400mm lens, which would magnify ANY bit of noise so severely I'd cry. So it's all about the digital shooting technique, using the histogram etc.. This image is close to full frame!
http://www.amatteroflight.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/AGL5608.jpg
With birds, shutter speed is often king. More so than not. I always pick the most open (widest) aperture and highest ISO that I can use, generally up to ISO800 and shoot in aperture priority mode. I want to control depth of field more than anything else. Shutter speeds are relevant, but with static subjects, slow speeds are also good. Using a good tripod also helps as does good technique of holding the gear. The more focal lenght the more magnification, the more vibrations show really easily on the sensor.
Here is the shot with the kit zoom lens. Almost full frame too!
I have to go now, but am happy to come back for more discussion. Feel free to ask anything. There are many ways to skin a cat (not literally) and everyone has their own ways. I strive to create great images and am quite obsessed with wildlife photography so I bought the best equipment I could afford and learned how to use it. With digital, there is a lot of technology to understand, a lot of areas that you need to be aware of, and most important (again) the histogram. It's your best friend. I have an example in a tutorial on how to minimize noise during capture, it should be sufficient to explain what shoot to the right is and how to correct overexposed images in post process.
http://amatteroflight.com/tutorials.html read tutorial 3 for starters, then 2 and 1.
cheers
Well firstly, thanks for the pertinent warning to start Akos...that was a mammoth effort...and secondly thanks for blowing me out of the water with my ideas on filters LOL . I will bow to your superior knowledge and experience here, only because I know you and absoolutely adore your photography! Maybe I will take the filter off the end of my lens but then I would have to take more care with that piece of garbage ( the lens) than what I usually do ! I can think of a lot of other reasons why my work is so bad lately..... mainly it is camera movement and poor judgement on my part. When I get a steadier hand I will take iti off and see if anything improves.
Thank you so much for taking the time and as usual being generous with your offer of help to any of us that may be in need. Feel free to share your obsessiveness abotu wildlife photography with me any time you want to :) I can never get over the results shown in your Cisticola shots with the stacked gear ..they are fantastic!
Cheers my wise and recently older friend :)
Adrienne
Sunshine Coast Queensland
thank you for the great Rainbow Bee-eater photo
Peter