I wonder who paid them for that research? I don’t believe any of it, I find it hair-raising nonsense. Even a lame excuse to throw cigarette butts on the street. What a sad conclusion to make, that birds use cigarette butts as " insulation" and to deter bugs from entering the nest. They use our waste because they can't find anything else, it’s there, and most of their natural nest building material has disappeared. What next? Rubbish tips are great for birds, because they find a lot of food there?? How perverse are we?
This was widely reported on the net yesterday so check it out for yourself. No-one's saying it's a good thing, just that they are doing it. The research done by the National Autonomas University of Mexico. Another couple of articles:
The last paragraph of "the-scientist" website says this:
"Though Garcia thinks toxicity is unlikely to accumulate to dangerous levels in a bird’s short life span, he and his students are already getting started on studying the causes and consequences of bird’s cigarette habits—and whether or not they should kick the habit."
Like they say,there's not likely to be any side effects in a bird's short life span,but what about it building up over the years?Some bird species will be constantly contacting the cigarettes,year after year,egg,chick,and adult alike - surely there will be some side effects eventually? I mean,obviously the cigarettes aren't natural,so they must do something that affects the birds...
It's like the "quest" to save the Great Barrier Reef:"Injecting them with a nutrient broth that encourages a naturally-occurring pathogenic bacteria," which will eventually kill the starfish - again,surely there has to be some long-term side effect to the native sea creatures around the starfish?
I haven't had the time yet to read all of the research findings (???), trust me, I know how reaserch works. Nothing is more powerful and can and will invest more money into finding new markets, than the Tobacco Industry. (we all should know that by now). It is no accident the research was done in Mexico, one of the largest Tobacco Producer in the world. The idea is , to find new markets , as there is a decline in consumption in the developed countries, Tobacco Companies mainly target Africa.
This should give you some info:
A Rich Tobacco Tradition Mexico is also home to the world’s richest man, Carlos Slim Helú, who is Latin America’s biggest tobacco baron, with a seat on the Philip Morris International board of directors and a stake in the company’s Mexican brands. Philip Morris and British American Tobacco dominate the cigarette market in Mexico. They´ve been involved in farm production since the late 1990s after the government privatized national tobacco production. BAT eventually purchased Cigarrera La Moderna and Philip Morris increased its shares in Slim´s Cigatam. Other foreign companies now produce tobacco for cigarettes sold abroad.
I will look more into it tonight.
A bit of cynisism on my part: we could all buy cigarettes and fill the dog's bed with them. The dog would be free of flees, and the Tobacco Industry would have a new market.
On the surface the research is interesting but, like Araminta, I'm also interested to learn who funded the research. The tobacco industry has been notorious for funding any research it thinks will increase its profits & denying any research findings which might threaten its profits. I have little doubt that the tobacco industry will use every bit of information that might improve its tarnished image, even to the point of funding research on butts in nests. If it hasn't funded this research (& I accept that it's possible it hasn't) then I'm confident their boffins will be beavering away on finding ways to use,even burnish, the research results to the industry's benefit. This is BIG TOBACCO'S culture. And Nathan is wise to raise the question of the long term effects of butts in nests. I'll be interested to learn if there will be any research into this.
By the way, the first report mentioned by Wendy talks about "non-smoked" cigarette butts. I would have thought this was an oxymoron.
Just for the record, I'm a rabid non-smoker and I only posted this because I thought it would be of general interest as bird behaviour.
What I found interesting is this:
"It's not a big surprise," said Mark Hauber, who studies the evolution of avian behaviors at Hunter College in New York, and was not involved in the study. "We always knew that some birds put pungent herbs in their nests to keep insects and mites at bay, so why not use cigarettes?" They are readily available in any urban environment and tobacco provides a natural insect repellent."
We know some birds collect things (e.g. bowerbirds with their blue items) and various species use their own construction methods and materials.
Has anyone come across "pungent herbs" in nests? I wonder if some birds build nests using say tea tree leaves/twigs.
Wendy
Mandurah, WA
Peel-Yalgorup System Ramsar Site
Not yet, Wendy, although I keep looking for one of Ms Woko's Early Grey tea bags.
Seriously, I haven't noticed that any birds use pungent herbs. We have lots of Dry Land Tea Trees Melaleuca lanceolata on our place & I understand local aboriginal people used the foliage as an antiseptic. But my recollection is that this is used mainly by Red Wattle Birds for nesting material. They also build lots of their nests in this shrub/tree. Maybe there aren't a lot of pungent herbs in my neighbourhood (parsley might get a guernsey) or maybe there aren't a lot of nasties to be warded off by local birds.
It is an interesting observation and thanks for the article Wendy. Still, my own opinion is that I also doubt that birds have evolved enough to note that tobacco reduces pests in nests (PIN) rather it is a side effect of their collecting "rubbish" as Armaminta put it. Birds also collect dog and other animal hair to line their nests, if researchers could show that birds prefer the hair from a dog/animal using a flea control product because it also has an impact on PIN then I would give this a bit more credence. Still, I have very occasionally been wrong before ..... ha ha ha!!!
I love these kind of discussions, to me, reading peoples opinions and the reasoning behind it is part of the appeal of a good forum!
Alison
~~~~~~
"the earth is not only for humans, but for all animals and living things."
It wouldn't suprise me if the tobacco industry funded this research, trying to make their product seem more natural, there's nothing they won't stoop to. What gets me steamed up is the whole cotdeath/sids issue. It turned out that more than 50% of cot deaths are attributable to the parents smoking, but all we heard about was don't co-sleep or put your baby on it's tummy. In fact if you don't smoke the chance of your baby dying of sids are pretty remote. When you think of all the babies that have died due to tobacco, it's mass murder but you never hear about it.
I’m with you Greg, money and morals just don’t go together in general. The power those companies have is unbelievable .
Just take another example, “junk food” ,the amount of money they put into pushing their crap and target children that make their parents buy. All very clever marketing. Truckloads of sugar added to soft drinks to make people addicted to them. To see how it works, you only have to have a look in shopping trolleys in supermarkets. Ah, and 5 isles of cleaning products, they convince people to buy. Kill bacteria we really need to build up our immune system. All separate topics , but all coming from the same place “greed and money"
Wendy I have noticed a variety of birds love to gather before bed time in Camphor Laurel trees. Wyong station and Hornsby station fo r example unfortuneately the Trees are gone now called noxious weeds . Could the Camphor been a natural remedy against lice. If anybody has any ideas. If we observe what trees the birds gather to chat and sleep, why not plant them.Maybe this noxious weed may help our feathered buddies from LICE. We can plant any tree we want in our own back yards. Just dont plant them near sewer pipes. Norm
Hi there, Norm. I'm not sure why anyone would plant Camphor Laurel, a feral weed, in preference to local species which native birds of the locations mentioned have evolved with over aeons. Also, I'm interested to learn of the connection you seem to have made between Camphor Laurel & lice prevention in birds. Has research been done on this.
I wonder who paid them for that research? I don’t believe any of it, I find it hair-raising nonsense. Even a lame excuse to throw cigarette butts on the street. What a sad conclusion to make, that birds use cigarette butts as " insulation" and to deter bugs from entering the nest. They use our waste because they can't find anything else, it’s there, and most of their natural nest building material has disappeared. What next? Rubbish tips are great for birds, because they find a lot of food there?? How perverse are we?
M-L
This was widely reported on the net yesterday so check it out for yourself. No-one's saying it's a good thing, just that they are doing it. The research done by the National Autonomas University of Mexico. Another couple of articles:
http://www.the-scientist.com/?articles.view/articleNo/33541/title/Marlboro-Chicks/
http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn22587-smokers-help-birds-ward-off-mites.html
It's not so far fetched. Tobacco has long been known to herbalists as being a parasitic. There's a snippet in this study which found tobacco 100% effective against lice in goats: http://www.academicjournals.org/ajb/PDF/Pdf2005/Apr/Fajimi%20and%20Taiwo.pdf
Wendy
Mandurah, WA
Peel-Yalgorup System Ramsar Site
http://www.flickr.com/photos/girlinoz/
The last paragraph of "the-scientist" website says this:
"Though Garcia thinks toxicity is unlikely to accumulate to dangerous levels in a bird’s short life span, he and his students are already getting started on studying the causes and consequences of bird’s cigarette habits—and whether or not they should kick the habit."
Like they say,there's not likely to be any side effects in a bird's short life span,but what about it building up over the years?Some bird species will be constantly contacting the cigarettes,year after year,egg,chick,and adult alike - surely there will be some side effects eventually? I mean,obviously the cigarettes aren't natural,so they must do something that affects the birds...
It's like the "quest" to save the Great Barrier Reef:"Injecting them with a nutrient broth that encourages a naturally-occurring pathogenic bacteria," which will eventually kill the starfish - again,surely there has to be some long-term side effect to the native sea creatures around the starfish?
I haven't had the time yet to read all of the research findings (???), trust me, I know how reaserch works. Nothing is more powerful and can and will invest more money into finding new markets, than the Tobacco Industry. (we all should know that by now). It is no accident the research was done in Mexico, one of the largest Tobacco Producer in the world. The idea is , to find new markets , as there is a decline in consumption in the developed countries, Tobacco Companies mainly target Africa.
This should give you some info:
A Rich Tobacco Tradition Mexico is also home to the world’s richest man, Carlos Slim Helú, who is Latin America’s biggest tobacco baron, with a seat on the Philip Morris International board of directors and a stake in the company’s Mexican brands. Philip Morris and British American Tobacco dominate the cigarette market in Mexico. They´ve been involved in farm production since the late 1990s after the government privatized national tobacco production. BAT eventually purchased Cigarrera La Moderna and Philip Morris increased its shares in Slim´s Cigatam. Other foreign companies now produce tobacco for cigarettes sold abroad.
I will look more into it tonight.
A bit of cynisism on my part: we could all buy cigarettes and fill the dog's bed with them. The dog would be free of flees, and the Tobacco Industry would have a new market.
M-L
On the surface the research is interesting but, like Araminta, I'm also interested to learn who funded the research. The tobacco industry has been notorious for funding any research it thinks will increase its profits & denying any research findings which might threaten its profits. I have little doubt that the tobacco industry will use every bit of information that might improve its tarnished image, even to the point of funding research on butts in nests. If it hasn't funded this research (& I accept that it's possible it hasn't) then I'm confident their boffins will be beavering away on finding ways to use,even burnish, the research results to the industry's benefit. This is BIG TOBACCO'S culture. And Nathan is wise to raise the question of the long term effects of butts in nests. I'll be interested to learn if there will be any research into this.
By the way, the first report mentioned by Wendy talks about "non-smoked" cigarette butts. I would have thought this was an oxymoron.
Just for the record, I'm a rabid non-smoker and I only posted this because I thought it would be of general interest as bird behaviour.
What I found interesting is this:
"It's not a big surprise," said Mark Hauber, who studies the evolution of avian behaviors at Hunter College in New York, and was not involved in the study. "We always knew that some birds put pungent herbs in their nests to keep insects and mites at bay, so why not use cigarettes?" They are readily available in any urban environment and tobacco provides a natural insect repellent."
We know some birds collect things (e.g. bowerbirds with their blue items) and various species use their own construction methods and materials.
Has anyone come across "pungent herbs" in nests? I wonder if some birds build nests using say tea tree leaves/twigs.
Wendy
Mandurah, WA
Peel-Yalgorup System Ramsar Site
http://www.flickr.com/photos/girlinoz/
Not yet, Wendy, although I keep looking for one of Ms Woko's Early Grey tea bags.
Seriously, I haven't noticed that any birds use pungent herbs. We have lots of Dry Land Tea Trees Melaleuca lanceolata on our place & I understand local aboriginal people used the foliage as an antiseptic. But my recollection is that this is used mainly by Red Wattle Birds for nesting material. They also build lots of their nests in this shrub/tree. Maybe there aren't a lot of pungent herbs in my neighbourhood (parsley might get a guernsey) or maybe there aren't a lot of nasties to be warded off by local birds.
It is an interesting observation and thanks for the article Wendy. Still, my own opinion is that I also doubt that birds have evolved enough to note that tobacco reduces pests in nests (PIN) rather it is a side effect of their collecting "rubbish" as Armaminta put it. Birds also collect dog and other animal hair to line their nests, if researchers could show that birds prefer the hair from a dog/animal using a flea control product because it also has an impact on PIN then I would give this a bit more credence. Still, I have very occasionally been wrong before .....
ha ha ha!!!
I love these kind of discussions, to me, reading peoples opinions and the reasoning behind it is part of the appeal of a good forum!
Alison
~~~~~~
"the earth is not only for humans, but for all animals and living things."
It wouldn't suprise me if the tobacco industry funded this research, trying to make their product seem more natural, there's nothing they won't stoop to. What gets me steamed up is the whole cotdeath/sids issue. It turned out that more than 50% of cot deaths are attributable to the parents smoking, but all we heard about was don't co-sleep or put your baby on it's tummy. In fact if you don't smoke the chance of your baby dying of sids are pretty remote. When you think of all the babies that have died due to tobacco, it's mass murder but you never hear about it.
I’m with you Greg, money and morals just don’t go together in general. The power those companies have is unbelievable .
Just take another example, “junk food” ,the amount of money they put into pushing their crap and target children that make their parents buy. All very clever marketing. Truckloads of sugar added to soft drinks to make people addicted to them. To see how it works, you only have to have a look in shopping trolleys in supermarkets. Ah, and 5 isles of cleaning products, they convince people to buy. Kill bacteria we really need to build up our immune system. All separate topics , but all coming from the same place “greed and money"
M-L
Oh, forgot to mention how those cleaning products pollute the environment. But never mind, they clean your bathroom and make you smell fresh.
M-L
Wendy I have noticed a variety of birds love to gather before bed time in Camphor Laurel trees. Wyong station and Hornsby station fo r example unfortuneately the Trees are gone now called noxious weeds . Could the Camphor been a natural remedy against lice. If anybody has any ideas. If we observe what trees the birds gather to chat and sleep, why not plant them.Maybe this noxious weed may help our feathered buddies from LICE. We can plant any tree we want in our own back yards. Just dont plant them near sewer pipes. Norm
Hi there, Norm. I'm not sure why anyone would plant Camphor Laurel, a feral weed, in preference to local species which native birds of the locations mentioned have evolved with over aeons.
Also, I'm interested to learn of the connection you seem to have made between Camphor Laurel & lice prevention in birds. Has research been done on this.
Yer. Lice are really hard to control without chemicals and such. (I know this from experience) could be useful with some research.
Wimmera mally region, Vic.